Many blasts but genetically abnormal


#1

I am really puzzled by the latest developments.
In April, out of 12 blasts, we had 2 normal ones. Other ten had monosomy or trisomy abnormalities. Today, I received the report that out of 5 blasts, none is normal. I haven’t discussed with my dr about this in detail, but he suggested laporoscopy. I don’t have endo or any cysts (that I aware of). I asked him why he had suggested that, but I still have not received the answer.
Anyone experienced situation like mine or heard of it?

Thanks ladies


#2

I’m very sorry about your PGS results. I agree that something is off. There can be cycle to cycle variation, but having 2 cycles with low or no normals is either really unlucky or reflective or egg or sperm quality issues. For you age, usually at least 50% of blasts tested are normal. I hope your RE has some helpful info.


#3

[QUOTE=YellowAster]I’m very sorry about your PGS results. I agree that something is off. There can be cycle to cycle variation, but having 2 cycles with low or no normals is either really unlucky or reflective or egg or sperm quality issues. For you age, usually at least 50% of blasts tested are normal. I hope your RE has some helpful info.[/QUOTE]

We do have severe male factor involved, but who can guarantee that eggs are ok too . However, in my family history, there is no fertility issues, but there is in my husband’s.


#4

My situation is similar, and with significant male factor (in this case morphology) and we’ve had pretty crappy results. It’s all in my footer below.


#5

[QUOTE=cosmopolitan4112008]I am really puzzled by the latest developments.
In April, out of 12 blasts, we had 2 normal ones. Other ten had monosomy or trisomy abnormalities. Today, I received the report that out of 5 blasts, none is normal. I haven’t discussed with my dr about this in detail, but he suggested laporoscopy. I don’t have endo or any cysts (that I aware of). I asked him why he had suggested that, but I still have not received the answer.
Anyone experienced situation like mine or heard of it?

Thanks ladies[/QUOTE]

Hi, I am sorry about your results:(
Did your dr check karyotypes of both u and your husband? I had similar issue with my first IVF before we knew about balanced chromosomal translocation I carry…


#6

Yes we checked our karyotypes. We are both normal.


#7

[QUOTE=cosmopolitan4112008]Yes we checked our karyotypes. We are both normal.[/QUOTE]

Cosmopolitan, I’m sorry to hear that so few blasts were normal :frowning: Since you have a lot of monosomy and trisomy, its pretty obvious that you (or more likely) your husband has gametogenesis issues which, naturally, wouldn’t show up on your karytyping test because you were testing somatic cells and not germ line cells. For one reason or another, the sister chromitids are failing to separate and gametes are getting too many or too few chromosomes.

Has he done The Male Reproductive Panel yet? It isn’t a semen analysis by-the-way, its much more sophisticated than just examining morphology or abundance.
MRH Panel - Male Reproductive Health Panel | MaleFactor

My guess is there’s a good chance he hasn’t. It could be insightful and it isn’t terribly expensive (around $700, last time I checked).

Anyway, hope this was helpful, and good luck.


#8

Thank you Demian. We did semen dna defragmentation.it is on the border between normal and abnormal. Also osa was done where itshowed results were not good. Basically, it pointed out there wrre chemicals around the sperm that damage it. Are these the tests what you meant? He was taking pycnagenol and some other vitamins. Im waiting to see her sperm analysis from this cycle. Im afraid not a lot can be done in his case.


#9

I am really surprised Dr. B is not pointing to the sperm as the issue for the low # of normals.

Or did he, and I missed it?


#10

He didn’t point at it really.then I wrote to him an emsil and told him everything plus that im not convinced it was an egg issue. He said that he agreed on the points I made. On a retrieval day, I asked Carlos how come we got only 2 normals out of 12. He told me it was strange given my age. I told him why to rush with a conclusion that it was because of the eggs. I told him we have a mf involved. He told me I wad right. Seems to me they don’t know details of my case, but I don’t know why they point at eggs immediately. Im 33 not 43 to jump to the conclusion.
All previpus times I had 3 or 4 blasts and would end up with 2 or 3 normals. I’m starting to doubt thst either bc or cetrotide did something because I didnt use them before but ganirelix and no bc.


#11

[QUOTE=cosmopolitan4112008]He didn’t point at it really.then I wrote to him an emsil and told him everything plus that im not convinced it was an egg issue. He said that he agreed on the points I made. On a retrieval day, I asked Carlos how come we got only 2 normals out of 12. He told me it was strange given my age. I told him why to rush with a conclusion that it was because of the eggs. I told him we have a mf involved. He told me I wad right. Seems to me they don’t know details of my case, but I don’t know why they point at eggs immediately. Im 33 not 43 to jump to the conclusion.
All previpus times I had 3 or 4 blasts and would end up with 2 or 3 normals. I’m starting to doubt thst either bc or cetrotide did something because I didnt use them before but ganirelix and no bc.[/QUOTE]

Hm, I don’t want to cast around suspicion carelessly (though I must admit, I am innately suspicious of doctors), but your doctors seem to be giving a rather odd synopses. Given the test results that you’ve gotten so far about sperm quality, it IS strange that they are focused on eggs as the culprit.

Has ICSI been part of your protocol at all, given that there are known sperm issues?


#12

Yes, icsi always.and even the embryologyst confirmed to me that regardless of the fact that they choose a sperm based on its shape, still it can be abnormal.


#13

[QUOTE=cosmopolitan4112008]Yes, icsi always.and even the embryologyst confirmed to me that regardless of the fact that they choose a sperm based on its shape, still it can be abnormal.[/QUOTE]

Well, then it doesn’t sound like there’s too much more you can do, protocol wise. ICSI will help cut down on some of the bad sperm, but otherwise its just a crap shoot. Two normal blastocysts isn’t terribly shabby, either way, given that a lot of people don’t even get 2 five day. I wish I had more info to give you. Good luck.


#14

Cosmopolitan,

I am sorry about what you have been going through. It sounds to me like some all-too common male gender bias in reproductive endo. For years they were telling us all fertility - baby health issues were caused by the mother. Now we know a lot of genetic abnormalities come from aging fathers. I agree with you, at your age, egg quality is not likely to be the issue at all. Given your husband’s age (and the results you have already been given) it is much more likely a sperm issue.

I am sorry and wish you both the best.


#15

Sounds like they are doing IMSI which is looking at the sperm for selection. However, it is my understanding that PICSI is better at identifying the best sperm. As I understand it, they use a particular solution or media to attract the higher quality sperm. I don’t know a lot about it because I have never done it. I would ask about it to see if it is an option at your clinic.


#16

I used picsi once and the results were the same as with icsi. Even the embryologist told me she hadnt noticed it was a big deal to use. I will make sure they employ imsi next time since it is available there.